Which trance producers have quit for lack of money, begged for donations, complained about deals and financials?

[trancefan2020]

I know and remember of three of them but the list could be long (Airwave, Mirco de Govia and "Nitrous Oxide") . Airwave is known for complaining and rightfully so about his lack of pay and I remember the guy behind Mirco de Govia flat out saying that he couldn't support himself from the meagre pay and "Nitrous Oxide" was virtually sobbing at the lack of invites for shows and pathetic internet pay. This maybe due to some issues with trance or electronic music which makes it good in club settings makes it not practical elsewhere . Maybe I should make a thread about poor popularity of trance or poor profitability of it?

Anyway , it is hard to make a living in the trance scene because the music is long and users are used to going somewhere to listen to it more or less for free and where they have expectation but they are also harsh critics . Even the MusicExpress guy Twan is barely scraping a thousand views and is begging for donations when he should be one of the faces of the scene. While Trance is great to listen to in the dark and open spaces , it's not at all good in places where people spend time and money , in their room or in the car let alone work, so we have poor producers and unfortunate sellouts.

 

[Magdelayna]

Airwave is the one that really sticks out for me - im just a bedroom producer,and ive just reached £50K in revenue from streaming etc....so someone like Airwave,who is classed as one of the 'legends' of the scene,made many classics,was on all the CD compilations back in the day,made tracks with Armin etc - this guy shouldve earnt hundreds of thousands of pounds - but it looks like to me,his career wasnt 'managed' properly.

I know he shyed away from the spotlight quite a bit and wasnt keen on playing classic sets all the time - but even things like his Youtube channel should be a LOT bigger - its just a massive shame in my eyes,it was a big opportunity lost.

But,i would say for most 'lesser' Trance producers,it is VERY hard to make a full time living from it - you mentioned guys like Mirco de Govia. Unless you DJ every week and is booked up ALL year...

It really annoys me that most Trance producers cant make a living from it,when its such a beautiful form of music - im not sure what its like in other genres of music?

 

[badass]

I disagree,

I know and remember of three of them but the list could be long (Airwave, Mirco de Govia and "Nitrous Oxide") . Airwave is known for complaining and rightfully so about his lack of pay and I remember the guy behind Mirco de Govia flat out saying that he couldn't support himself from the meagre pay and "Nitrous Oxide" was virtually sobbing at the lack of invites for shows and pathetic internet pay. This maybe due to some issues with trance or electronic music which makes it good in club settings makes it not practical elsewhere . Maybe I should make a thread about poor popularity of trance or poor profitability of it?

Anyway , it is hard to make a living in the trance scene because the music is long and users are used to going somewhere to listen to it more or less for free and where they have expectation but they are also harsh critics . Even the MusicExpress guy Twan is barely scraping a thousand views and is begging for donations when he should be one of the faces of the scene. While Trance is great to listen to in the dark and open spaces , it's not at all good in places where people spend time and money , in their room or in the car let alone work, so we have poor producers and unfortunate sellouts.

I disagree with the statement that trance is not good in a car or work, those are the very places I listen to trance the most. I also love listening to trance in my room. I think the main reasons why trance isn't popular is because 1. Most trance tracks are instrumentals. Almost 100% of all popular music has vocals. 2. The tracks are too long, especially the intros where there is not a lot happening, just a simple kick and bass line and some drums. This was a difficult thing for me to overcome when I first started to listen to trance. I'd fast forward and fast forward thinking that the entire track was just like the 1 minute long intro. I used to lose interest just within that one minute mark.

I also think most people don't have the attention span to listen to a track for 7 or 8 minutes, especially instrumental tracks.

I wish trance was more popular and more easily accessible to people so that talented producers could make a living from it.

 

[Progrez]

I disagree,

I disagree with the statement that trance is not good in a car or work, those are the very places I listen to trance the most. I also love listening to trance in my room. I think the main reasons why trance isn't popular is because 1. Most trance tracks are instrumentals. Almost 100% of all popular music has vocals. 2. The tracks are too long, especially the intros where there is not a lot happening, just a simple kick and bass line and some drums. This was a difficult thing for me to overcome when I first started to listen to trance. I'd fast forward and fast forward thinking that the entire track was just like the 1 minute long intro. I used to lose interest just within that one minute mark.

I also think most people don't have the attention span to listen to a track for 7 or 8 minutes, especially instrumental tracks.

I wish trance was more popular and more easily accessible to people so that talented producers could make a living from it.

I think the fans and djs who are in other genres are to blame as well. They distance themselves from the genre thinking it's a dirty genre or bad a genre as well. I listen to at home that whole argument is a load of crap. The only people who enjoy that kind of shit have drunk too much alcohol that their braincells have started to rot.

 

[tranceissomewhatalive]

a while ago Breakfast posted some of that too, blaming Flashover for not paying him (enough) off his tracks revenue

 

[Jetflag]

I wish trance was more popular

you know....Controversial opinion as it might be but I actually wish the opposite/ hope it stays like this for as long as it can.

I think popularity is the death of any genre as it will make it, sooner or later, devolve into "pop" because you know:.... "popular" ....After which it will get ditched for whatever comes next. Popularity is just that much of a Darwinian construct.

I'm actually quite thankful for an (art) scene that is somewhat genuine.

That doesn't have many artists who jump on for the money.
That doesn't have fans or lovers of the genre just because its "the thing" for that year.
That has many artists who have a daytime job struggling to pay for rent and gear just so they can make music in the off-hours for the absolute love of it, not the buck of it.


Do we honestly want kids down the street cringe-yelping about "who's the bettur twens deejey!" to one another and collecting fap-posters of enigma state in their bedroom like pokemon cards?

wuh..

Don't know how about you but I like trance and ambient for that matter to be my thing. and the thing of a handfull of people with genuine heart for it.



my 2 cents.

 

[badass]

you know....Controversial opinion as it might be but I actually wish the opposite/ hope it stays like this for as long as it can.

I think popularity is the death of any genre as it will make it, sooner or later, devolve into "pop" because you know:.... "popular" ....After which it will get ditched for whatever comes next. Popularity is just that much of a Darwinian construct.

I'm actually quite thankful for an (art) scene that is somewhat genuine.

That doesn't have many artists who jump on for the money.
That doesn't have fans or lovers of the genre just because its "the thing" for that year.
That has many artists who have a daytime job struggling to pay for rent and gear just so they can make music in the off-hours for the absolute love of it, not the buck of it.


Do we honestly want kids down the street cringe-yelping about "who's the bettur twens deejey!" to one another and collecting fap-posters of enigma state in their bedroom like pokemon cards?

wuh..

Don't know how about you but I like trance and ambient for that matter to be my thing. and the thing of a handfull of people with genuine heart for it.



my 2 cents.

I appreciate and respect your perspective. I believe that a genre like trance can be (and wish) would be more like hip hop. There are hip hop artists that make music from the heart and for the love of the art and are able to make a living doing that. They're not multi millionaires but their music pays the bills and live a comfy lifestyle without having to sell out. Some strike a good balance between being widely recognized and not losing their vision for the art and make music that is deep and introspective and it's very genuine.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[Mosquito]

Not quite trance, but I've got a screenshot from 2018

 

[Enlusion]

Not quite trance, but I've got a screenshot from 2018

View attachment 2893

So true

 

[TRANCEBLASTER]

there seems to be only two paths: either you produce and play music as a hobby that occasionally brings in some extra kesh, or you pursue it professionally.

in the latter case, anybody in today's world has the freedom to produce high quality music, get it signed to a relevant label, and find a competent booking agency. Just releasing music and waiting for emails with gig offers is probably just a fantasy.

+in my opinion, DJs especially should focus more on the local scene. since music has been played digitally, track exclusivity is no longer unique in the same terms like back in the 90's. and it is quite a nonsense these days to call a headliner whos fee is €2,000 or more. sometimes, guys from the next neighborhood (who, of course, no one has ever heard of) have a more interesting music collection than some superstar Dj who is only famous because of his ghosted releases.
currently, smaller events with local DJs are thriving in European cities. These events typically host 100 to 250 people, the dance floors are usually full, the DJs get to play longer sets, and no one goes bankrupt.

+over the last six years, 'Trance' has become a relevant style again. It seems that 'KI/KI' and some bigroom 'Techno' djs are benefiting the most from this, and maybe more artists should take inspiration from this.

 

[afterhourpower]

Just in general: there are so many many many dj’s right now in so many genres. It looks so hard to make a living.

 

[trancefan2020]

Add Airbase to the list. He said it in one of the interviews.

 

[Julian Del Agranda]

maybe more artists should take inspiration from

The problem is that marketing-dj’s take the place of those who would like to out of passion. Ki/ki or Superstrings or the one with green hair… or Charlotte de Witte…

They all pretend to love ‘old trance’ right? Like they are the savior of ‘real raves’ and ‘real trance’.

but not once did one of them play an Enigma State track…

And that’s what the worst about our scene. Producer-passionates aren’t supported, they just don’t care and will get booked anyway, because their marketing works very well. Audience has no clue either. They will praise the chick with green hair, just because she paints it green every week, hurray for that. Did absolutely nothing to support the scene in the last decade, but that’s no issue either.

So to conclude: either hop on board and create TikTok videos eventhough you may be a 35y + adult man.
OR….. keep it simple, make some songs you like, expect 10 plays and 0 comments. Be proud of your non-painted hair. And be happy with that. And maybe post a little rant once in a few months.

I think I’m in that second group lol.

 

[LostLegend]

The problem is that marketing-dj’s take the place of those who would like to out of passion. Ki/ki or Superstrings or the one with green hair… or Charlotte de Witte…

They all pretend to love ‘old trance’ right? Like they are the savior of ‘real raves’ and ‘real trance’.

but not once did one of them play an Enigma State track…

And that’s what the worst about our scene. Producer-passionates aren’t supported, they just don’t care and will get booked anyway, because their marketing works very well. Audience has no clue either. They will praise the chick with green hair, just because she paints it green every week, hurray for that. Did absolutely nothing to support the scene in the last decade, but that’s no issue either.

So to conclude: either hop on board and create TikTok videos eventhough you may be a 35y + adult man.
OR….. keep it simple, make some songs you like, expect 10 plays and 0 comments. Be proud of your non-painted hair. And be happy with that. And maybe post a little rant once in a few months.

I think I’m in that second group lol.

I think you’d suit green hair mate

 

[Jetflag]

I think you’d suit green hair mate

yes, lets communicate to the whole world that he's nearing 40 and riddled with lice

 

[LostLegend]

yes, lets communicate to the whole world that he's nearing 40 and riddled with lice

 

[Magdelayna]

Add Airbase to the list. He said it in one of the interviews.

That was years ago,and then he came back - producers only do this to gain some attention. As someone said,you cant 'retire' from music - its a bloody hobby at the end of the day.

 

[TRANCEBLASTER]

The problem is that marketing-dj’s take the place of those who would like to out of passion. Ki/ki or Superstrings or the one with green hair… or Charlotte de Witte…

They all pretend to love ‘old trance’ right? Like they are the savior of ‘real raves’ and ‘real trance’.

but not once did one of them play an Enigma State track…

And that’s what the worst about our scene. Producer-passionates aren’t supported, they just don’t care and will get booked anyway, because their marketing works very well. Audience has no clue either. They will praise the chick with green hair, just because she paints it green every week, hurray for that. Did absolutely nothing to support the scene in the last decade, but that’s no issue either.

So to conclude: either hop on board and create TikTok videos eventhough you may be a 35y + adult man.
OR….. keep it simple, make some songs you like, expect 10 plays and 0 comments. Be proud of your non-painted hair. And be happy with that. And maybe post a little rant once in a few months.

I think I’m in that second group lol.

yes, and it's always been this way. nothing new. only the tools of promotion are changing every 5 years.

many tunes from the past wouldn't be 'trance classic's' if a major label hadn't gotten behind them: tv/radio rotations, cd compilations, magazines...

would be 'Tiesto' so big without 'Dimitri De Wit'?)



I mentioned 'KI/KI' because she plays music for the current generetion, fresh and energetic, well produced and mastered. she fits in the 'zeitgeist' of the 2020's.. 'Enigma State' seems to appeal more to those looking for nostalgia. these are two very different worlds

 

[Progrez]

yes, and it's always been this way. nothing new. only the tools of promotion are changing every 5 years.

many tunes from the past wouldn't be 'trance classic's' if a major label hadn't gotten behind them: tv/radio rotations, cd compilations, magazines...

would be 'Tiesto' so big without 'Dimitri De Wit'?)



I mentioned 'KI/KI' because she plays music for the current generetion, fresh and energetic, well produced and mastered. she fits in the 'zeitgeist' of the 2020's.. 'Enigma State' seems to appeal more to those looking for nostalgia. these are two very different worlds

Not Nostalgia dude but great and proper uplifting and euphoric melodic Trance.

 

[JohnnyBarefoot1992]

I disagree,

I disagree with the statement that trance is not good in a car or work, those are the very places I listen to trance the most. I also love listening to trance in my room. I think the main reasons why trance isn't popular is because 1. Most trance tracks are instrumentals. Almost 100% of all popular music has vocals. 2. The tracks are too long, especially the intros where there is not a lot happening, just a simple kick and bass line and some drums. This was a difficult thing for me to overcome when I first started to listen to trance. I'd fast forward and fast forward thinking that the entire track was just like the 1 minute long intro. I used to lose interest just within that one minute mark.

I also think most people don't have the attention span to listen to a track for 7 or 8 minutes, especially instrumental tracks.

I wish trance was more popular and more easily accessible to people so that talented producers could make a living from it.

1. While it's not exactly wrong, the truth is that a considerable amount of Trance tracks promoted on big shows such as A.S.O.T. actually have vocals, in fact, most TOTY's of that show, if not the vast majority of them, are vocal tracks with pure instrumentals being a rather low minority. I can only think of "Clear Blue Moon" in 2001, "Air for Life" in 2005, "Tuvan" in 2009, "Intense" in 2013, "Anahera" in 2015 and "Destination" in 2023, other than those, all TOTY's of A.S.O.T. have been vocal tracks, so, I wouldn't necessarily claim the fact that most Trance tracks being instrumentals being necessarily a factor on the genre itself being less popular these days, especially because back in the late 90's to early 2000's most Trance tracks which became popular were instrumental themselves, so I'm not really sure if that can be attributed to a lack of popularity of the genre itself these days.

2. While that's also true, it's not totally appliable in most cases as there have always been radio edit versions of many Trance tracks out there, including lesser known ones. I don't know if you are familiar with Compilation series such as Dream Dance and Future Trance, but both compilation series have always included mostly radio edit versions of many Trance and even other Electronic Dance Music tracks, and both those compilation series have managed to remain relevant even with the advent of illegal downloading and even streaming, so, I wouldn't necessarily consider the extended duration of Trance tracks necessarily a turn-off for some people for the genre as since late 2016 most big labels such as Armada and Anjunabeats now consider shorter versions the original versions with the complete versions being the Extended Mixes, so, I'm not really sure if that's such a turn-off for "average people" since radio edits are now more widely available than ever.

3. We are more than ever living in an era in which indeed the attention span for most people has become gravely reduced. A considerable amount of pop records these days doesn't even reach three full minutes. We have some clear examples of this such as "Espresso" by Sabrina Carpenter which clocks at 2:55 completely skipping the usual bridge part of a song, so, obviously Trance may suffer a bit from this as even extended mixes these days barely go beyond 5:15 sometimes, putting as evidence the idea that people no longer have long attention-spans. This might have something to do with TikTok and the prevalence of really short videos there, but that's quite true. Nowadays more than five minutes might be a lot for some people as they want their stuff to be as quick as possible so they can move on to the next track. Is this a bad thing? It's questionable, but one thing is for sure: I think in 25 years from now most people won't remember most post-2007 Trance tracks out there, while most stuff released between 1992 and 2007 will be forever remembered as timeless Trance classics that will forever define the beauty of this great music genre.