What's on your mind today?

Julian Del Agranda · Jan 22, 2022

You really had 1,5 meters distance to literally everybody in your life for the last two years?

People get covid because they are with family for a day. I’ve had it too. Christmas gift last year.

Its flu, but jetflag, the impact on your condition/fitness is quite big for lots. It may take weeks or months to fully breath and excersize “100%”. Pretty much everyone I know including myself and BF, dead tired after a simple 3 kilometer walk. For weeks.

Now that’s nothing life-threatening, however it is different from a regular flu.

However #2, that wasn’t omicron.

In my opinion older overweight people now had a chance to get vacinated. If they don’t want it, then why do young people have to live with restrictions? IC beds are fine now, and signs from England and Denmark about omicron are great. Open up the country.

And stop with silly symbolic stuff like cleaning the cart in stores, as recent studies showed that people really don’t get I’ll from touching a cart.

and stop with face masks, because 99,99% of the people re-uses old ones, which means their effect is gone. Nobody puts on a new one every 3 hours… People touch their mask, put it in their pocket. Use it again later. Including me and everyone I know.

Progrez · Jan 22, 2022

This is crazy like I would have never thought of this idea at all.

Jetflag · Jan 22, 2022

Magnevi said:
Its flu, but jetflag, the impact on your condition/fitness is quite big for lots. It may take weeks or months to fully breath and excersize “100%”. Pretty much everyone I know including myself and BF, dead tired after a simple 3 kilometer walk. For weeks.

Now that’s nothing life-threatening, however it is different from a regular flu.

However #2, that wasn’t omicron.

In my opinion older overweight people now had a chance to get vacinated. If they don’t want it, then why do young people have to live with restrictions? IC beds are fine now, and signs from England and Denmark about omicron are great. Open up the country.

And stop with silly symbolic stuff like cleaning the cart in stores, as recent studies showed that people really don’t get I’ll from touching a cart.

and stop with face masks, because 99,99% of the people re-uses old ones, which means their effect is gone. Nobody puts on a new one every 3 hours… People touch their mask, put it in their pocket. Use it again later. Including me and everyone I know.

Well like all things covid it depends per person. I'm on of those 99,7% who not only don't need additional medication/breathing apparatus but I also recover quite rapidly. in fact my Isolation period ends today, might catch a wave later on, see how my paddling skills hold up.

if I drown i'll send a pigeon to poop on your head tomorrow so you can inform the rest

100% agreed on the rest. if we're going to get stuck with this disease hence forth we need a long term strategy. So protect the weak/elderly, scale up ITU beds for future covid waves. Vacciante whoever wants too, and lock yourself in when you have symptoms/test positivly.

For the rest open up.

dmgtz96 · Jan 22, 2022

Open up, but let remote workers stay remote if they want to and none of their responsibilities require them on-site.

Hot Tuna · Jan 22, 2022

Magnevi said:
You really had 1,5 meters distance to literally everybody in your life for the last two years?

People get covid because they are with family for a day. I’ve had it too. Christmas gift last year.

Was the question for me? If so, of course not, because that has not been the rule here. I understand your frustration if 1.5m distancing from every single person has been enforced where you are for 2 years.

Your second part is true. It's also true that people get it because they get 'fed up' with the things designed to protect them, or refuse it outright. For every numpty that goes out and adds themselves to the statistics, you move a step away from those restrictions being lifted.

dmgtz96 · Jan 23, 2022

I guess this is why NL people are pissed, and I would say rightfully so:

The Netherlands introduced a strict lockdown in December 2020, following a rapid rise in Covid-19 cases. The country's first night time curfew since World War II was brought in in January, leading to rioting in major cities. The Netherlands entered another strict lockdown on December 19 due to yet another increase in coronavirus infections.

While restrictions were eased as the country looked to return to normal life, officials have since been forced to bring some of them back due to a rapid rise in cases.

dmgtz96 · Jan 26, 2022

well, r/antiwork imploded

Jetflag · Jan 27, 2022

dmgtz96 said:
I guess this is why NL people are pissed, and I would say rightfully so:

except our brilliant government has 0 means of enforcing it, They've been structurally cutting down on public institutions like the army, police, hospitals etc.
which is why on newyears eve for instance this.

happened.

And the police just, well. watched.. What are you gonna do? arrest 10 million citizens?

Jetflag · Jan 27, 2022

dmgtz96 said:
well, r/antiwork imploded

just watched the interview, amazing

Rok · Jan 27, 2022

Magnevi said:
In my opinion older overweight people now had a chance to get vacinated. If they don’t want it, then why do young people have to live with restrictions? IC beds are fine now, and signs from England and Denmark about omicron are great. Open up the country.

And stop with silly symbolic stuff like cleaning the cart in stores, as recent studies showed that people really don’t get I’ll from touching a cart.

and stop with face masks, because 99,99% of the people re-uses old ones, which means their effect is gone. Nobody puts on a new one every 3 hours… People touch their mask, put it in their pocket. Use it again later. Including me and everyone I know.

Completely agree, especially with the bolded part.

So much of covid related things are complete theatre. I remember I saw a while ago in Australia they had a Rugby match with thousands of spectators and after it was done, guys in hazmat suits came onto the field and started disinfecting it. Absolute nonsensical theatre.

Also don't even get me started on masks. In a hospital environment where they are used as they should, they of course make sense, but 95% of us CANNOT use them that way. Then there are things like mask rules in bars (at least we had that here), where you have to wear one while walking, but can take it off as soon as you sit down, even though you are still in the same place, breathing the same air as everyone else. It just seems like theatre

dmgtz96 · Jan 27, 2022

Rok said:
Also don't even get me started on masks. In a hospital environment where they are used as they should, they of course make sense, but 95% of us CANNOT use them that way.

Most people can wear face masks just fine. Now, if you're talking about the ultra-fitted surgical masks that require you to have no facial hair... maybe?
It's still better to wear a face mask than not if you're, say, at a gym or somewhere indoors and you aren't eating/drinking.

Julian Del Agranda · Jan 27, 2022

Why is it better to still use facemasks in a gym, somewhere indoor, if you are not eating/drinking?

Doesn't the virus (usuallly) spread in the air because people sneeze or cough? And via hands because spreader touches himself on the face and then touches others with those hands?

Infections through the air via people who "breath" (no sneeze/cough) isn't a common and likely spreading-method I believe.

Therefor facemasks are mostly symbolic. In Holland this was even confirmed by the goverment. It's not a restriction because the thing itself helps much. It's a restrictions because all the masks visible in the streets creates awareness that there is still "a serious situation" where caution is suited. It's just to remind people that covid is there and people be alert. The actual thing itself.... is more symbolic...

It's why I hate the facemasks... why do we all wear it, if it's mostly symbolic...

(obviously, I understand the need for surgical masks in hospitals etc.... But I mean the facemasks that we all use for months and touch all the time)

dmgtz96 · Jan 27, 2022

Magnevi said:
Why is it better to still use facemasks in a gym, somewhere indoor, if you are not eating/drinking?

Doesn't the virus (usuallly) spread in the air because people sneeze or cough? And via hands because spreader touches himself on the face and then touches others with those hands?

Infections through the air via people who "breath" (no sneeze/cough) isn't a common and likely spreading-method I believe.

Therefor facemasks are mostly symbolic. In Holland this was even confirmed by the goverment. It's not a restriction because the thing itself helps much. It's a restrictions because all the masks visible in the streets creates awareness that there is still "a serious situation" where caution is suited. It's just to remind people that covid is there and people be alert. The actual thing itself.... is more symbolic...

It's why I hate the facemasks... why do we all wear it, if it's mostly symbolic...

(obviously, I understand the need for surgical masks in hospitals etc.... But I mean the facemasks that we all use for months and touch all the time)

COVID is airborne. At the start of the pandemic, people thought COVID only transmitted by sneezing/coughing and touching infected surfaces, which is why everyone was so serious about disinfecting surfaces back then. Surface transmission is in fact rare, but you obviously shouldn't touch your T-zone if you've touched potentially infected surfaces.
Figure published in a recent WSJ article, from unvaxx'd spring 2021 data:

If both infected and non-infected are wearing cloth masks, transmission time goes from 15 min to 27 min. That's almost double and is pretty legit for the minor inconvenience of wearing a face mask.

Magnevi said:
Therefor facemasks are mostly symbolic. In Holland this was even confirmed by the goverment. It's not a restriction because the thing itself helps much. It's a restrictions because all the masks visible in the streets creates awareness that there is still "a serious situation" where caution is suited. It's just to remind people that covid is there and people be alert. The actual thing itself.... is more symbolic..

... but COVID is still a serious situation requiring caution. The virus is still there, and people should still be alert.

Jetflag · Jan 27, 2022

dmgtz96 said:
... but COVID is still a serious situation requiring caution. The virus is still there, and people should still be alert.

so hang up billboards, drive a car with a megaphone through the streets, get commercials on radio and television...

face daipers are only going to annoy people in the long run and create resentment/rebellious attitudes.

Julian Del Agranda · Jan 27, 2022

I find that graph really strange. I mean......... how conventient are those results...

No masks.... 15 minutes.... simple mask: 20 minutes.... advanced mask: 25 minutes... extreme mask: 30 minutes. Power-rangers-mask: 35 minutes.

Cmon..... that's not science. That's jsut..... sucking it out of your thump... (that's a dutch expression maybe, but I guess you get what it means)

And to be clear.... I am pro-suitable-restrictions. But these numbers are calculated with some sort of formula. But that's not the real world.

Also: in most "facemask-situations" you walk by someone... supermarket, any store, city center (outside in busy spots)... In all those situations you are with somebody only for a few seconds. So based on the graph, you can conclude that wearing a facemask is silly in all those situations.

Julian Del Agranda · Jan 27, 2022

dmgtz96 said:
.. but COVID is still a serious situation requiring caution. The virus is still there, and people should still be alert.

Yeah alright.

So.... implement good working (non symolic!) restrictions.... that people can understand and are willing to do.

Wearing a new surgical facemask every 3 hours is something zero % of the population does.

Everyone re-uses their mask for months... and that's another reason why the graph you posted is useless.

dmgtz96 · Jan 27, 2022

jetflag said:
so hang up billboards, drive a car with a megaphone through the streets, get commercials on radio and television...

face daipers are only going to annoy people in the long run and create resentment/rebellious attitudes.

That would require actual competent leadership by politicians and the medical community!
cries in Mexican

Magnevi said:
And to be clear.... I am pro-suitable-restrictions. But these numbers are calculated with some sort of formula. But that's not the real world.

Also: in most "facemask-situations" you walk by someone... supermarket, any store, city center (outside in busy spots)... In all those situations you are with somebody only for a few seconds. So based on the graph, you can conclude that wearing a facemask is silly in all those situations.

I get where you're coming from, but that's basically how research works

Magnevi said:
Yeah alright.

So.... implement good working (non symolic!) restrictions.... that people can understand and are willing to do.

Wearing a new surgical facemask every 3 hours is something zero % of the population does.

Everyone re-uses their mask for months... and that's another reason why the graph you posted is useless.

Improved HVAC would help a lot. Recycle air is what caused the virus to transmit easily in the early stages of the pandemic, but zones like chemistry labs with no recycle air are fairly safe.
The problem is that advanced HVAC technology and not recycling air are both expensive. If I'm going to a damp, crowded room with poor ventilation you can bet I'm wearing a mask and would hope others in the same space are also wearing masks.

Jetflag · Jan 27, 2022

dmgtz96 said:
That would require actual competent leadership by politicians and the medical community!
cries in Mexican

sadly salutes and sheds a single man tear in Frysian

Hot Tuna · Jan 27, 2022

Rok said:
So much of covid related things are complete theatre. I remember I saw a while ago in Australia they had a Rugby match with thousands of spectators and after it was done, guys in hazmat suits came onto the field and started disinfecting it. Absolute nonsensical theatre.

Are you absolutely sure about this? If something sounds ridiculous, then perhaps it is. There is no evidence of this happening anywhere online. You are aware that they spray pitches for various reasons including basic hydration, and dew-resistant substances? I would say 99% confidently that this is actually what happened, and someone has twisted the truth.

Rok said:
Also don't even get me started on masks.

OK, gladly.

Hot Tuna · Jan 27, 2022

Magnevi said:
Doesn't the virus (usuallly) spread in the air because people sneeze or cough? And via hands because spreader touches himself on the face and then touches others with those hands?

No? Why would breathing out be any different to sneezing/coughing out if you are infected?

Magnevi said:
Infections through the air via people who "breath" (no sneeze/cough) isn't a common and likely spreading-method I believe.

Happy for you to provide a source for this. I believe most studies have shown the opposite. I haven't caught so much as a cold in 2 years of mask wearing, it's been great.

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