Conservative or liberal (politics)

[Jetflag]

This has nothing to do with the ‘culture war’. I think you’re letting your obsession with it cloud your opinions on other matters.

Do yourself a favour and look up what the Prosperity Bible actually is, why it’s a problem and why people like Joel Osteen and Kenneth Copeland are so universally disliked by anyone with a conscience and have been long before this so called ‘culture war’ has been around.

We where talking about megachurches in general, not just the examples you mentioned. And the "culture war" i'm refereing to in this context is not just what happened in the last 14 years online.. it is something that has been going on in the USA since the Founding Fathers, (in particular those between Lockian and the Russeaun Libaral camps)
and again, like I said and I quote: "’m sure some of them are" the con artists you mention.

But unlike you, who's read this on the internet somewhere I actually visited some, and the stereotype of the aforementioned Osteen and Copeland examples just don't hold up and where nowhere to be found there.

Welp, Biden has stepped down.

I guess we'll find out soon who's gonna be running in his place.

Incredibly dumb move...Honestly, if they don't unanymously put forth Kamala without challence? Trump might very well be the next Potus again.

 

[Progrez]

Incredibly dumb move...Honestly, if they don't unanymously put forth Kamala without challence? Trump might very well be the next Potus again.

I honestly blame the media for this they report so many things about him stepping down "There are growing pressuring of Joe Bien Stepping down" No doubt the media had some influence on him.

 

[Jetflag]

@dmgtz96

They did an interview with lichtman 6 days ago, worth the watch

 

[Jetflag]

I honestly blame the media for this they report so many things about him stepping down "There are growing pressuring of Joe Bien Stepping down" No doubt the media had some influence on him.

Yeah there’s a very good reason why I don’t take much of what the legacy media sais serious anymore

 

[Progrez]

Yeah there’s a very good reason why I don’t take much of what the legacy media sais serious anymore

There is so much bias out there and I am finding that out on Sky News and Youtube in general that there is a lot of clickbait titles and thumbnails which is why I am thinking of qutting Youtube altogether.

 

[dmgtz96]

Yeah there’s a very good reason why I don’t take much of what the legacy media sais serious anymore

On that, we agree. Media coverage from CNN, NYT, and WSJ has been shit. They're all owned by billionaires, who want to put Trump in office to protect their own wealth.

And yeah. That sounds very conspiracy-y, but that is basically how younger liberal leaning people view mainstream media. We don't trust it, either.

 

[dmgtz96]

Incredibly dumb move...Honestly, if they don't unanymously put forth Kamala without challence? Trump might very well be the next Potus again

So I was playing video games and went to get groceries, and holy shit I missed the news about Biden stepping down by several hours. Jeez.
I don't think Kamala will be the Democrat candidate. She's too unlikable, has a shady past behind her (jailed too many minorities for minor weed offenses), and unfortunately she's a woman of color. We need a normal white guy like Newsom to run for president.

 

[Jetflag]

On that, we agree. Media coverage from CNN, NYT, and WSJ has been shit. They're all owned by billionaires, who want to put Trump in office to protect their own wealth.

And yeah. That sounds very conspiracy-y, but that is basically how younger liberal leaning people view mainstream media. We don't trust it, either.

well, there seems to be a bit of a trend with conspiracy theories nowadays and it goes something like this:

step1:
Thats not true and "misinformation" and you're a conspiratorial nut!! All the "experts" said so! just shut it!

step2:
well, ok, maybe there is some truth to it as new evidence teethgrittingly surges

step3:
ok its actually true, and here's why its a good thing!

 

[Jetflag]

a normal white guy like Newsom

that one genuinly made me lol and now my 1 year old is awake, thanks for that.

 

[LostLegend]

and again, like I said and I quote: "’m sure some of them are" the con artists you mention.

The point I was making, is that the Prosperity Bible on which these churches preach to their congregation is inherently exploitative.
If you are manipulating people by making them believe that God will help them, not if they are good christians and follow the commandments and whatnot, but by giving more of your money to the church (the more you give, the more God will help you), then there is no "some of them are bad" to it.
These people horde wealth, live in multi million dollar homes, have fleets of cars and even private jets. They are con artists each and every one.

To be clear, I'm not saying ALL churches, but those ran by clergy who preach the Prosperity Bible.

But unlike you, who's read this on the internet somewhere

You honestly have zero idea what and how I know about these places Honestly, you are better than this type of sniping.

 

[Jetflag]

You honestly have zero idea what and how I know about these places Honestly, you are better than this type of sniping.

I will say that i should have added "probably" in there, which I didn't in the haste. But seriously B?

You consider "But unlike you, who's read this on the internet somewhere" <- Sniping / and assuming stuff from my end to yours,

but “ you’re letting your obsession with it cloud your opinions on other matters.” a perfectly educated guess and somehow you no assuming stuff on my end?

its a bit of "bad faith" faith m8, (in line with the topic), I didn't snipe you, It was an educated guess. afaik you're not a US citizen, come from the states, or have been part of any of said churches there so.... but I could be wrong.

The point I was making, is that the Prosperity Bible on which these churches preach to their congregation is inherently exploitative.

yes, and the point I was making is that I disagree its inherently exploitative. its far more giving back to the congregation in the form of community programs and charity (again in my estimation and the places i've visited) and even just spiritual well being for it to be just that. They (perhaps not the specific ones you mentioned) make "profit" in the same way Boudewijn Poelman, or a Casino does.

They "sell" hope, basically. which is a bit repugnant, I agree, but hardly criminal.

And yes, they fly private jets m8, so what? politicians do that all the time and they demand your money by taxes to pay for that. At least these "priest con artist" don't have any fiat to force it from you without your explicit consent.

edit:

and no, I'm not part of any of these churches or any church in particular in case you think i might be proselytizing here.

 

[LostLegend]

yes, and the point I was making is that I disagree its inherently exploitative. its far more giving back to the congregation in the form of community programs and charity (again in my estimation and the places i've visited) and even just spiritual well being for it to be just that. They (perhaps not the specific ones you mentioned) make "profit" in the same way Boudewijn Poelman, or a Casino does.

I think we can just agree to disagree here.
I love you mate, but all this is reinforcing why I try to avoid these debates on here

 

[LostLegend]

Anyway, back to todays news.

It'll be interesting to see how this goes from here.

Talking to some friends of mine in the States before, Kamala doesn't seem to be all that well liked, even by Democrat voters themselves in some circles. She'd probably need a very strong VP to counter that. One friend was suggesting Beshear, the Kentucky Govenor.
I'll be honest and say I don't really know much at all about him, but have been told he's democrat Gov in a red state that appears to be in reasonably good standing with the mostly republican locals and has done a pretty good job there so far. Could be a really smart pick to have someone who has a broad appeal and getting a straight, white, Christian man to run with her does wonders for the *ahem* optics.

Also noticed Kennedy has put a statement out declaring his interest to be nominated.
Once again, I don't know a huge amount about him aside from the obvious, but have liked a lot of what he's had to say. I know there was a lot of people calling him a conspiracy theorist recently, but I'm led to believe there's been a pretty obvious smear campaign against him, his comments being taken out of context and what-not?

I'll bow to the superior intel from you guys on this one

 

[Jetflag]

I think we can just agree to disagree here.
I love you mate, but all this is reinforcing why I try to avoid these debates on here

no damnit, I will agree with you, and there aint nothing you can do about it!



(heart emoji)

 

[Jetflag]

Anyway, back to todays news.

It'll be interesting to see how this goes from here.

Talking to some friends of mine in the States before, Kamala doesn't seem to be all that well liked, even by Democrat voters themselves in some circles. She'd probably need a very strong VP to counter that. One friend was suggesting Beshear, the Kentucky Govenor.
I'll be honest and say I don't really know much at all about him, but have been told he's democrat Gov in a red state that appears to be in reasonably good standing with the mostly republican locals and has done a pretty good job there so far. Could be a really smart pick to have someone who has a broad appeal and getting a straight, white, Christian man to run with her does wonders for the *ahem* optics.

Also noticed Kennedy has put a statement out declaring his interest to be nominated.
Once again, I don't know a huge amount about him aside from the obvious, but have liked a lot of what he's had to say. I know there was a lot of people calling him a conspiracy theorist recently, but I'm led to believe there's been a pretty obvious smear campaign against him, his comments being taken out of context and what-not?

I'll bow to the superior intel from you guys on this one

I think kennedy might be the only one who can actually beat Trump. but only if he keeps running with his current VP and under his current program.

I think right now it all depends on how united the democrats seem. If there will be a squabble as to who should be the next nominee (debates et all) trump will probably win.

If the current Biden administration however simply "stays the same" with the exeption of his VP taking the lead, the Dems might keep two keys of incumbency and no party contest. which would grant them a victory over Trump, if the overall foreign/economic or social unrest cards don't flip.

 

[Jetflag]

 

[LostLegend]

View attachment 2197

If there's one bad thing about him dropping out, it's that the Kamala v Trump memes will be nowhere near as good.

 

[SaltAcidFatHeatAcid]

It'll be interesting to see how this goes from here.

Talking to some friends of mine in the States before, Kamala doesn't seem to be all that well liked, even by Democrat voters themselves in some circles. She'd probably need a very strong VP to counter that. One friend was suggesting Beshear, the Kentucky Govenor.

In talking with friends back when and recently, I recalled a few things from the previous nomination cycle about Harris:

• Her track record was a bit flip floppy trying to appeal to progressive voters while having a fairly conservative record as a prosecutor/AG.
• Her positions on healthcare (which was a seriously hot issue in 2019) were a bit flip floppy as well.
• She is an exceptional debater, though with Biden/Sanders/Warren in the mix, I think she struggled to connect with voters.
• Her campaign apparatus and funding was not up to her competitors.

Looking more at 2024, she's super sharp, and a kickass debater, and will not stand down. She has a unique background and low age that could help bring some 'unite' vibes, especially if paired with the right VP (like Mark Kelly fingers crossed). As for unlikability? That's another word for 'woman' in politics, which is 100% horseshit, but here we are. Warren caught the same flack as she also takes no shit. I suspect most Dem voters will warm to her, if they had any real inkling of voting for a female democrat in the first place.

As for the Trump vs Anyone in the election. Trump's campaign is making a strong run at being 'for the working people', who are a strong voting block in swing states. While I find that somewhat laughable given the policy being proposed by their team previously, currently , and indirectly through Project 2025 goals, I am also not expecting a big % of voters to be in the least bit informed in making their vote decision. Most voters aren't current with the cases against him, have forgotten all the horrific things he's done and said it seems. And since the Dems have lost so much blue collar support, this is the part that has me the most worried. As well as the fact that Harris was/is the border czar, which they can blame squarely on her. The border + inflation pain are likley going to be the two hottest topics for the Trump team vs. Dems with Abortion and the threat of the end of democracy, and lauding their accomplishments. It's anyone's guess, and in political timelines, the election is a long way away still. I hope they debate though.

 

[dmgtz96]

Kamala was unpopular in 2020 because progressives were severely anti-cop and anti-law enforcement. After the recent crime waves, someone who is "tough on crime" sounds fairly appealing.

 

[Jetflag]

Dems with Abortion

I still don’t get why the dems are still reeling from this. The Roe v Wade legislation was the ultimate paper tiger of symbol politics, overruled by any individual state legislation and as such only a hindrance towards an áctually effective piece of law that would make abortion a (constitutional) right.

yet they treat it like a Muslim would a Quran burning.



if you are pro a national abortion right, you should celebrate the deadweight roe v wade being out of the way imo