Covid and vaccines and whatnot

Hot Tuna

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HIiiii Jetflag, how's the

I for one will not be engaging any further

going?

NhSIFUS.png
 

Hot Tuna

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Ahh, I shouldn't laugh, bless him. He needs his safe space from my dangerous, evil "it would be nice to treat fellow humans with a bit more respect" opinions.
 

Gagi

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Ok guys, let's not turn to mocking and bickering. Keep this as an argument about ideas, not about finger-pointing and labeling or calling each other names.
 

jetflag

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Ok guys, let's not turn to mocking and bickering. Keep this as an argument about ideas, not about finger-pointing and labeling or calling each other names.
he still at it isn't he? 😄 god bless the ignore button🙏
 

Gagi

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It's getting fairly interesting now. The legal docs leaked, and two points remain:

1. He was denied entry by the customs officer or w/e, based on his (seemingly) subjective opinion. The visa was approved beforehand and it seemed like everything was valid.

2. He was not treated humanely. Arrived after a 25-hour flight, was held until early in the morning, and when he got the bed, he was awoken quite quickly for the interview; wasn't given the appropriate accommodation (including a tennis court), was put under pressure etc.

So while morally it's a gray-area (not getting vaccinated, appearing in public while infected etc.), legally he didn't break any laws of Australia and should be allowed entry.

But still think it doesn't really matter whether or not they allow him to stay and play. Something for which you have to carefully prepare, months in advance, to follow a strict regime, regarding diet, training and rest ... to be just put at the mercy of one officer, to ruin the chase of records and greatness... It can't be easy coming back from that. Even if he plays, I find it hard to believe he wins it.
 
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dmgtz96

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But still think it doesn't really matter whether or not they allow him to stay and play. Something for which you have to carefully prepare, months in advance, to follow a strict regime, regarding diet, training and rest ... to be just put at the mercy of one officer, to ruin the chase of records and greatness... It can't be easy coming back from that. Even if he plays, I find it hard to believe he wins it.
Like, I get where you're coming from, but you could say something similar about the illegal immigrants from Central America that risk their lives on their way to the US, through the Sonoran Desert and that could be kidnapped by drug cartels. The main difference (and what really matters) is that Djokovic isn't technically doing anything illegal here.

As you pointed out, if Djokovic is allowed to stay and play, the stress from this entire situation could impact his performance.
 

Gagi

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I'd need you to help me understand how similar a tennis player with a seemingly valid visa is to an illegal immigrant from Central America.
 

dmgtz96

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I'd need you to help me understand how similar a tennis player with a seemingly valid visa is to an illegal immigrant from Central America.
this part:

Something for which you have to carefully prepare, months in advance, to follow a strict regime, regarding diet, training and rest ... to be just put at the mercy of one officer, to ruin the chase of records and greatness

I did specify that the main difference is that Djokovic hasn't done anything illegal (as far as we know). Apart from that, I don't see why I need to give Djokovic more empathy than I would to illegal Central American immigrants who also go through a grueling and dangerous journey just because he's a tennis player.
 
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jetflag

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this part:

Something for which you have to carefully prepare, months in advance, to follow a strict regime, regarding diet, training and rest ... to be just put at the mercy of one officer, to ruin the chase of records and greatness

I did specify that the main difference is that Djokovic hasn't done anything illegal (as far as we know). Apart from that, I don't see why I need to give Djokovic more empathy than I would to illegal Central American immigrants who also go through a grueling and dangerous journey just because he's a tennis player.
We shouldn't. This is not a matter of kindness. frankly I've never heard the name Djokovic before today and i genuinly do not give on squat about the man (or is it a woman? dunno even)

This is, AFAIK a matter of state-bullying against someone who did nothing wrong but isn't not onboard with "the narrative" Now the person bullied can be a saint or an asshole, thats just a partisan/tribal matter and frankly something (i think) is completely irrelevant.

its the State bullying/ being made an example of part here that should worry anyone (still) wanting to set foot in Australia.
 
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dmgtz96

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We shouldn't. This is not a matter of kindness. frankly I've never heard the name Djokovic before today and i genuinly do not give on squat about the man (or is it a woman? dunno even)

This is, AFAIK a matter of state-bullying against someone who did nothing wrong but is not onboard with "the narrative" Now the person bullied can be a saint or an asshole, thats just a partisan/tribal matter and frankly something (i think) is completely irrelevant.

its the State bullying/ being made an example of part here that should worry anyone (still) wanting to set foot in Australia.
Correct. I appreciate this perspective.
 
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Hot Tuna

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That's not a jibe at you btw, you tend to be on the right side of things.

Djokivic's main defence currently hinges on the fact that he reported a positive Covid test on 16th Dec, which he initially understood gave him the relevant exemption to enter the country. Confusion has since ensued. Even if he is ultimately allowed in, it has now emerged that he attended an event the very next day on 17th Dec (i.e. knowing he had a positive result) maskless, and in contact with other people. He also attended further events in the following days. Guy is a documented bellend, and the fact that all the wrong people like Nigel Farage and others are jumping to his support (despite having no previous involvement or interest in tennis or Serbia) should tell you all you need to know.


Edit: @Gagi did already post this a page back.
 
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dmgtz96

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My heart bleeds. Karma is a bitch.
That's not a jibe at you btw, you tend to be on the right side of things.
It would actually be really bad if it turns out he did jump through all the required hoops and then the Australian government suddenly switched things up on him purely for political gain.

According to the Guardian thread ,
  • If the court grants Djokovic a win, the government could once again cancel his visa and detain him.

How long does this need to go on??

More from the thread:
Judge Anthony Kelly has noted that the ONLY ground the delegate relied on when deciding to cancel Djokovic’s visa is that:”the presence of its holder in Australia is or may be, or would or might be, a risk to: (i) the health, safety or good order of the Australian community or a segment of the Australian community”

o.o

Like, I agree with the Australian government not letting him enter the country due to rules/laws, but this whole situation is absurd
 
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dmgtz96

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Watched some parts of the court case. Naomi is such a mood - she as a junior barrister just chillin' reminds me of those meetings that I'm pulled in but can't even speak (because my seniors are doing all the talking)